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	<title>Comments on: Reflections on Anah Crow&#8217;s Uneven and s/m in Romance and RL</title>
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	<link>http://www.readreactreview.com/2009/07/20/reflections-on-anah-crows-uneven-and-sm-in-romance-and-rl/</link>
	<description>Rethinking romance and other fine fiction</description>
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		<title>By: Jessica</title>
		<link>http://www.readreactreview.com/2009/07/20/reflections-on-anah-crows-uneven-and-sm-in-romance-and-rl/#comment-3388</link>
		<dc:creator>Jessica</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Jul 2009 21:18:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.racyromancereviews.com/?p=3143#comment-3388</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;@ Tumperkin&lt;/b&gt;:
Yes, I agree, absolutely. something Sarah F said over at the DA post was that shades of D/s are very prevalent in mainstream het romance, but s/m less so. 

&lt;b&gt;@ SonomaLass&lt;/b&gt;:
I may just have ot pick that Dahl up, although the other contemp I read of hers was just ok for me. I plan to read a historical by her.

&lt;b&gt;Tumperkin&lt;/b&gt; wrote:
&lt;blockquote&gt;Jessica – the book that Laura’s link refers to is one of the ones I sent you….
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Yes, I got two Lamb&#039;s. already on the first page of one I am ready to explode. You are trying to kill me!


&lt;b&gt;@ maymay&lt;/b&gt;:
I am glad. I am trying to figure things out, and getting a lot of patient help!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>@ Tumperkin</b>:<br />
Yes, I agree, absolutely. something Sarah F said over at the DA post was that shades of D/s are very prevalent in mainstream het romance, but s/m less so. </p>
<p><b>@ SonomaLass</b>:<br />
I may just have ot pick that Dahl up, although the other contemp I read of hers was just ok for me. I plan to read a historical by her.</p>
<p><b>Tumperkin</b> wrote:</p>
<blockquote><p>Jessica – the book that Laura’s link refers to is one of the ones I sent you….
</p></blockquote>
<p>Yes, I got two Lamb&#8217;s. already on the first page of one I am ready to explode. You are trying to kill me!</p>
<p><b>@ maymay</b>:<br />
I am glad. I am trying to figure things out, and getting a lot of patient help!</p>
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		<title>By: maymay</title>
		<link>http://www.readreactreview.com/2009/07/20/reflections-on-anah-crows-uneven-and-sm-in-romance-and-rl/#comment-3380</link>
		<dc:creator>maymay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Jul 2009 04:21:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.racyromancereviews.com/?p=3143#comment-3380</guid>
		<description>This was a fantastic blog post, and one of the most academically interesting (and readable) pieces of writing I&#039;ve seen in a very long time. There&#039;s quite a lot here and I&#039;ll admit to being more than a little overwhelmed by the sheer amount of academic language that I&#039;m unsure I&#039;ve understood everything or that I can respond in a meaningful way. Suffice it to say that I enjoyed the read and will be chewing on this for a while. Thank you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This was a fantastic blog post, and one of the most academically interesting (and readable) pieces of writing I&#8217;ve seen in a very long time. There&#8217;s quite a lot here and I&#8217;ll admit to being more than a little overwhelmed by the sheer amount of academic language that I&#8217;m unsure I&#8217;ve understood everything or that I can respond in a meaningful way. Suffice it to say that I enjoyed the read and will be chewing on this for a while. Thank you.</p>
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		<title>By: Tumperkin</title>
		<link>http://www.readreactreview.com/2009/07/20/reflections-on-anah-crows-uneven-and-sm-in-romance-and-rl/#comment-3373</link>
		<dc:creator>Tumperkin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Jul 2009 21:30:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.racyromancereviews.com/?p=3143#comment-3373</guid>
		<description>Jessica - the book that Laura&#039;s link refers to is one of the ones I sent you....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jessica &#8211; the book that Laura&#8217;s link refers to is one of the ones I sent you&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: Laura Vivanco</title>
		<link>http://www.readreactreview.com/2009/07/20/reflections-on-anah-crows-uneven-and-sm-in-romance-and-rl/#comment-3371</link>
		<dc:creator>Laura Vivanco</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Jul 2009 17:05:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.racyromancereviews.com/?p=3143#comment-3371</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;The sex might be vanilla but it’s often peppered with very deliberate references to begging and submissiveness; heroes who demand verbal capitulations (say my name, tell me you want me etc). I think there could well be quite a lot of readers who wouldn’t dream of buying a BDSM book but who are living out those fantasies through romance&lt;/i&gt;.

I&#039;ve just come across a post I think might interest you, on just this topic. It was &lt;a href=&quot;http://charlottelamb.blogspot.com/2009/05/dark-dominion-alpha-male-run-amok.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;written by Charlotte Lamb&#039;s daughter, about some of her mother&#039;s novels&lt;/a&gt;: &lt;blockquote&gt;Someone once left a comment on this blog criticising some of Charlotte Lamb&#039;s early books as sadistic and unpleasant. I thought at the time that this critique was unfair. I am no longer quite so sure. However, that is not to say that I disapprove of these darker Lamb stories, or feel they ought not to have been written. They were immensely popular at the time of publication, and still make dynamic reading. Which suggests that they answered some kind of need in the mind of the reader&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>The sex might be vanilla but it’s often peppered with very deliberate references to begging and submissiveness; heroes who demand verbal capitulations (say my name, tell me you want me etc). I think there could well be quite a lot of readers who wouldn’t dream of buying a BDSM book but who are living out those fantasies through romance</i>.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve just come across a post I think might interest you, on just this topic. It was <a href="http://charlottelamb.blogspot.com/2009/05/dark-dominion-alpha-male-run-amok.html" rel="nofollow">written by Charlotte Lamb&#8217;s daughter, about some of her mother&#8217;s novels</a>:<br />
<blockquote>Someone once left a comment on this blog criticising some of Charlotte Lamb&#8217;s early books as sadistic and unpleasant. I thought at the time that this critique was unfair. I am no longer quite so sure. However, that is not to say that I disapprove of these darker Lamb stories, or feel they ought not to have been written. They were immensely popular at the time of publication, and still make dynamic reading. Which suggests that they answered some kind of need in the mind of the reader</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: Tumperkin</title>
		<link>http://www.readreactreview.com/2009/07/20/reflections-on-anah-crows-uneven-and-sm-in-romance-and-rl/#comment-3370</link>
		<dc:creator>Tumperkin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Jul 2009 16:09:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.racyromancereviews.com/?p=3143#comment-3370</guid>
		<description>Great post/ great discussion.  Rather than travel over ground already very well covered here re the points you directly posted about I&#039;ll offer some brief thoughts on BDSM and romance reading generally.

Y&#039;see what &lt;em&gt;I&lt;/em&gt; find fascinating is the echoes of BDSM that you find in regular romance.  I&#039;ve referred to this in the past as BDSM-lite in reviews I&#039;ve done of Nalini Singh and Sarah McCarthy books, but actually it&#039;s an observation that is much much wider and can be found right across the genre.  The sex might be vanilla but it&#039;s often peppered with very deliberate references to begging and submissiveness; heroes who demand verbal capitulations (say my name, tell me you want me etc).   I think there could well be quite a lot of readers who wouldn&#039;t dream of buying a BDSM book but who are living out those fantasies through romance.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post/ great discussion.  Rather than travel over ground already very well covered here re the points you directly posted about I&#8217;ll offer some brief thoughts on BDSM and romance reading generally.</p>
<p>Y&#8217;see what <em>I</em> find fascinating is the echoes of BDSM that you find in regular romance.  I&#8217;ve referred to this in the past as BDSM-lite in reviews I&#8217;ve done of Nalini Singh and Sarah McCarthy books, but actually it&#8217;s an observation that is much much wider and can be found right across the genre.  The sex might be vanilla but it&#8217;s often peppered with very deliberate references to begging and submissiveness; heroes who demand verbal capitulations (say my name, tell me you want me etc).   I think there could well be quite a lot of readers who wouldn&#8217;t dream of buying a BDSM book but who are living out those fantasies through romance.</p>
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		<title>By: SonomaLass</title>
		<link>http://www.readreactreview.com/2009/07/20/reflections-on-anah-crows-uneven-and-sm-in-romance-and-rl/#comment-3365</link>
		<dc:creator>SonomaLass</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Jul 2009 03:58:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.racyromancereviews.com/?p=3143#comment-3365</guid>
		<description>Wow, excellent discussion!  I haven&#039;t read&lt;em&gt;Uneven&lt;/em&gt;, but I am glad to know it exists. I remember SarahF saying that Dahl&#039;s novella got the emotions right, and I had to agree b/c I found it very moving, even though I&#039;m not into BDSM practice at all.  Clearly the protagonists were, and once you accepted that, the connection they made and the joy that brought were involving and powerful.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow, excellent discussion!  I haven&#8217;t read<em>Uneven</em>, but I am glad to know it exists. I remember SarahF saying that Dahl&#8217;s novella got the emotions right, and I had to agree b/c I found it very moving, even though I&#8217;m not into BDSM practice at all.  Clearly the protagonists were, and once you accepted that, the connection they made and the joy that brought were involving and powerful.</p>
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		<title>By: Sarah Frantz</title>
		<link>http://www.readreactreview.com/2009/07/20/reflections-on-anah-crows-uneven-and-sm-in-romance-and-rl/#comment-3364</link>
		<dc:creator>Sarah Frantz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Jul 2009 03:41:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.racyromancereviews.com/?p=3143#comment-3364</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;@ Kaetrin&lt;/b&gt;:
You&#039;re more than welcome, Kaetrin. I&#039;m glad I could do my little bit in attempting to explain. Open-minded knowledge-seeking is always a good thing, which is why I love this post of Jessica&#039;s. The foundation of &quot;Your kink is not my kink&quot; is open acceptance. What turns you on doesn&#039;t turn me on, but that&#039;s okay and I will not condemn you for what it is that does turn you on, even if I don&#039;t *get* it (informed consent implied in all of that, of course). If we had more of that in this world, it would be a much better place.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>@ Kaetrin</b>:<br />
You&#8217;re more than welcome, Kaetrin. I&#8217;m glad I could do my little bit in attempting to explain. Open-minded knowledge-seeking is always a good thing, which is why I love this post of Jessica&#8217;s. The foundation of &#8220;Your kink is not my kink&#8221; is open acceptance. What turns you on doesn&#8217;t turn me on, but that&#8217;s okay and I will not condemn you for what it is that does turn you on, even if I don&#8217;t *get* it (informed consent implied in all of that, of course). If we had more of that in this world, it would be a much better place.</p>
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		<title>By: Kaetrin</title>
		<link>http://www.readreactreview.com/2009/07/20/reflections-on-anah-crows-uneven-and-sm-in-romance-and-rl/#comment-3363</link>
		<dc:creator>Kaetrin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Jul 2009 03:31:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.racyromancereviews.com/?p=3143#comment-3363</guid>
		<description>Thanks Dr. Sarah for explaining the &quot;they just are&quot; thing.   I get it much better now.

It&#039;s just not my cup of tea.

Nevertheless, if I hadn&#039;t read Uneven and participated in discussions such as the one above I probably wouldn&#039;t know that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Dr. Sarah for explaining the &#8220;they just are&#8221; thing.   I get it much better now.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s just not my cup of tea.</p>
<p>Nevertheless, if I hadn&#8217;t read Uneven and participated in discussions such as the one above I probably wouldn&#8217;t know that.</p>
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		<title>By: Dear Author: Romance Novel Reviews, Industry News, and Commentary &#187; Blog Archive &#187; REVIEW: White Flag by Thom Lane</title>
		<link>http://www.readreactreview.com/2009/07/20/reflections-on-anah-crows-uneven-and-sm-in-romance-and-rl/#comment-3362</link>
		<dc:creator>Dear Author: Romance Novel Reviews, Industry News, and Commentary &#187; Blog Archive &#187; REVIEW: White Flag by Thom Lane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Jul 2009 18:02:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.racyromancereviews.com/?p=3143#comment-3362</guid>
		<description>[...] conversation into which this book so neatly inserts itself for me is one I&#8217;m having over at Jessica&#8217;s Racy Romance Reviews about Anah Crow&#8217;s Uneven (my review)and BDSM in fiction and real life. One thing that&#8217;s [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] conversation into which this book so neatly inserts itself for me is one I&#8217;m having over at Jessica&#8217;s Racy Romance Reviews about Anah Crow&#8217;s Uneven (my review)and BDSM in fiction and real life. One thing that&#8217;s [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Sarah Frantz</title>
		<link>http://www.readreactreview.com/2009/07/20/reflections-on-anah-crows-uneven-and-sm-in-romance-and-rl/#comment-3360</link>
		<dc:creator>Sarah Frantz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Jul 2009 01:06:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.racyromancereviews.com/?p=3143#comment-3360</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;@ Robin&lt;/b&gt;:
 &lt;blockquote&gt;I’d also be interested in knowing from those who have a lot of knowledge about the BDSM community whether there are any concerns about “going too far” or questions around whether the enjoyment of pain is always a natural urge or a healthy choice for people, or whether there is ever a differentiation made between the idea of “healthy” or “unhealthy” BDSM.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

As Ann says, absolutely! All the time. In fact, there&#039;s an acronym: YKINMK=Your Kink Is Not My Kink. Both an expression of, &quot;OMG, *why* does that turn you on?!&quot; and &quot;I guess I have to accept that it does and that you know what you&#039;re doing.&quot; But with a healthy dose of &quot;Are you sure that&#039;s healthy?&quot; tempered by, again, &quot;I guess you know what you&#039;re doing.&quot;

But yes, there&#039;s a lot of checking and rechecking, and I have to say that that parties I&#039;ve gone to are some of the safest places in the world. You ask permission (of someone) to touch, even on the level of a hug or a handshake. You are very aware of personal space and individual choice. You don&#039;t make judgements but are always there to check on people and their health and safety. There&#039;s dungeon masters who don&#039;t play at all, but just supervise. No one drinks. No drugs.

&lt;blockquote&gt; Which probably means that I am trying at some level to distinguish between being BDSM-identified and the practice of BDSM sex, if that’s possible.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Yes, again. Totally possible to be BDSM-IDed and not practice BDSM sex, as it is possible to be the other way around. However, there&#039;s not so much discussion in the community yet of actual sexual identification, rather than sexual activity. Almost all books out there are How To books, rather than What Does It Mean books. But most websites, dom or sub, are explorations of what it means to be BDSM IDed. That just hasn&#039;t transferred yet to print books (huh--hadn&#039;t really noticed that before).

Anyway....cool discussion!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>@ Robin</b>:</p>
<blockquote><p>I’d also be interested in knowing from those who have a lot of knowledge about the BDSM community whether there are any concerns about “going too far” or questions around whether the enjoyment of pain is always a natural urge or a healthy choice for people, or whether there is ever a differentiation made between the idea of “healthy” or “unhealthy” BDSM.</p></blockquote>
<p>As Ann says, absolutely! All the time. In fact, there&#8217;s an acronym: YKINMK=Your Kink Is Not My Kink. Both an expression of, &#8220;OMG, *why* does that turn you on?!&#8221; and &#8220;I guess I have to accept that it does and that you know what you&#8217;re doing.&#8221; But with a healthy dose of &#8220;Are you sure that&#8217;s healthy?&#8221; tempered by, again, &#8220;I guess you know what you&#8217;re doing.&#8221;</p>
<p>But yes, there&#8217;s a lot of checking and rechecking, and I have to say that that parties I&#8217;ve gone to are some of the safest places in the world. You ask permission (of someone) to touch, even on the level of a hug or a handshake. You are very aware of personal space and individual choice. You don&#8217;t make judgements but are always there to check on people and their health and safety. There&#8217;s dungeon masters who don&#8217;t play at all, but just supervise. No one drinks. No drugs.</p>
<blockquote><p> Which probably means that I am trying at some level to distinguish between being BDSM-identified and the practice of BDSM sex, if that’s possible.</p></blockquote>
<p>Yes, again. Totally possible to be BDSM-IDed and not practice BDSM sex, as it is possible to be the other way around. However, there&#8217;s not so much discussion in the community yet of actual sexual identification, rather than sexual activity. Almost all books out there are How To books, rather than What Does It Mean books. But most websites, dom or sub, are explorations of what it means to be BDSM IDed. That just hasn&#8217;t transferred yet to print books (huh&#8211;hadn&#8217;t really noticed that before).</p>
<p>Anyway&#8230;.cool discussion!</p>
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